Interview with Max, a student and climate organizer in his 20’s.

What brought you into climate work and the climate movement?

I’ve had a keen interest in climate change since high school and decided I wanted to dedicate my life towards mitigating its effects. I decided to focus on marine climate solutions and began a marine biology degree at UCSD. During my second year of this degree, feeling overwhelmed by the climate crisis and like we were running out of time like it was going to be too late by the time I got a PhD and could study the climate solutions I was interested in, I looked to activism. I found the Green New Deal at UCSD group which had formed a year earlier, and they welcomed me as a friend and comrade. The community of people who all cared about making a difference at our institution, and their local theory of change to make change where our voices matter the most, really made me feel like I was in the right place. I felt like I was supported, I was growing and gaining new skills, and my volunteer work was making a difference. That was three years ago! I am now fairly well versed with the climate movement in our region and some of the groups that connect us to coalition work all over the country and all over the world.

How would you describe your approach to organizing and mobilizing young people on climate?

I think that once I notice people have an interest in climate organizing, the first thing I express to them is that they can make a real, tangible difference by getting involved in a local collective action group. I emphasize the mental health benefits of climate action to reduce climate anxiety and feel fulfilled, and the friends and community feeling that comes along with it. Once they’re in, I’ve found the most effective way to mobilize people is through face-to-face onboarding meetings to place them within our organization and give them a specific job to do, so they feel some agency and some identity as climate activist.

Do you see any differences in your approaches based on age? 

I don’t have much experience organizing with anyone who’s not a college student, but I think I emphasize the community and friend-making more to those who are newer to UCSD, and emphasize the change-making and fulfillment more to those who are better established at UCSD, or who may have already dipped their toes into some other change-making organizations.

Thinking back to before the pandemic, pre-March 2020 – what did you consider the most effective way to engage and mobilize young people on climate? 

I was not involved in organizing before the pandemic. I think in-person meetings are always preferable to online meetings to help foster community strength and identity with a group, but online meetings are often preferable for convenience. Therefore, I think a mix of the two with some fully in person meetings, some hybrid, and some fully online is a great way to maximize all of the benefits.

During the pandemic, what were the primary ways that your organizing and your job changed? 

I was not involved, but I know that the UCSD GND went entirely online with zoom meetings and all communication over Slack.

And do you feel that positively or negatively impacted your ability to achieve your goals? 

It sounds like they felt much less effective during the campaign when they weren’t able to organize in person.

How has the transition to online organizing impacted your confidence in the movement’s effectiveness?

I don’t think that online organizing, at this point, has impacted my confidence in the movement’s effectiveness. I think that online organizing tools like slack and the google suite which we use extensively are very powerful tools, and when combined with effective in-person leadership training and team building, can make for some very effective teams. This gives me great confidence in our movement’s adaptability and strength.

Do you think it’s important to build a sense of collective efficacy or confidence among peers? How does that change with online organizing and activism? 

In most cases, yes! I think most people will engage much more, and be more productive, happy, and connected when they feel they have collective efficacy. I certainly do. I also recognize some people will never feel collective or personal efficacy because of the scale of the climate crisis, but can still be remarkably productive and engaged, just because it matters to them to do the right thing, even if they don’t believe that they’re making a difference.

I think that building this collective efficacy is much harder without in-person organizing. Online meetings make it much harder to build friendships and connections, and harder to generate feelings of belonging and identity as an activist, especially for newer members. I think this is one of the main reasons why getting together in person is so important, to foster collective efficacy, celebrate our wins, and collectively dream about how we want to change the world.

Do you see any parallels between the ways in which the U.S. govt has handled Covid and the way that it could address climate change?

It would be great if the Federal Government would devote a similar amount of resources and attention to tackling climate change as it did for stimulus packages, R&D for a vaccine, and rolling out vaccines once they were available. Even though there was partisan debate about how drastically the government needed to respond to COVID, they still spent a lot more energy on it than climate change. Their response to COVID, while sometimes muddled, still felt like it was an emergency. The response to the climate crisis thus far has not felt like they are responding to an emergency. There’s a reason we’re called the Green New Deal at UCSD! I think large-scale government spending to create green jobs and infrastructure is necessary to avoid the worst effects of climate change. On a scale even greater than what we saw for COVID, more akin to how the economy changed for the World Wars, even.

Similarly, do you see any parallels between the ways in which the U.S. public has handled COVID-19 and the way that it could address climate change?

I think that people were much more worried about COVID because there was a much lower psychological distance, COVID felt like something that threatened them and their families, while climate change remained a far-off, uncertain risk affecting people in other parts of the world. Therefore many people were supportive of COVID regulations that would safeguard their personal safety at the expense of certain personal or economic freedoms, while they might not all agree to the same expenses in return for climate policy. The partisan divisions seen with climate deniers and covid response skeptics were very similar as well, owing largely to a distrust in science and the government.

How do you feel about the Biden-Harris Administration’s approach to climate action, and any actions they’ve taken thus far?

They’re better than the other guy? It’s not saying much. I don’t have much faith in the federal government to take impressive action on climate, no matter who is in office. It seems like Build Back Better was pretty good and certainly ambitious, but obviously, it doesn’t matter because half of our elected officials don’t support climate policy. The Inflation Reduction Act is a good start, and I’m glad they were able to pass something, but it falls far short of the type of Green New Deal this country needs. My activism doesn’t engage with federal politics at all, I have a pretty low sense of efficacy on these matters.

How about Congress?

Congress is pretty useless for the same reasons, partisan gridlock, endless arguing, etc. I hope our next election cycle will see a change in this, but I’m not holding my breath.

How do you generally feel about the state of the youth climate movement and our prospects for progress? Are we moving in the right direction?

Yes! Despite all the negative stuff I just said about the federal government, I do have faith in the youth climate movement. I think that focusing on making tangible change in our communities and watching that change radiate outwards, what we call a local theory of change, is the way that our movement will be able to have widespread success. It will take passionate people organizing in towns and cities all over the world. I think the movement is growing year by year, getting stronger, more organized, and more directed toward tangible, realistic goals on the way to progress.